Lili talks with Emmett Grosland, Actor, Artist, Trans Advocate, and Maker of things. They discuss what it's been like filming during this time, what it means to be a Jack of All Trades as a multi-hyphenate artist, and collaboration.
Emmett's website
Emmett's instagram: @emgrosland
The World to Come musical podcast featuring Emmett!
Miles Square Theatre
TDQ’s Website
Instagram: @thedreadedquestion
Lili’s instagram: @lili_torre
Email: thedreadedquestionpodcast@gmail.com
TDQ Emmett Grosland
[00:00:00] Lili Torre: Hello, and welcome back to The Dreaded Question. I'm your host, Lili Torre, and this week I get to welcome the wonderful and amazing Emmett Grosland! Emmett and I met at the Jen Waldman Studio, and I've always admired him as a true multihyphenate artist.
He's incredibly talented in a wide variety of art forms, and to be honest, our conversation really sparked a lot of creative energy in me. I'd been feeling a bit down about theater in the past few weeks, but chatting with Emmet about collaboration, play, and being a jack of all trades really got me feeling inspired and excited about being a creative person. I hope our conversation does the same for you.
So let's find out what Emmett Grosland is up to.
So Emmett Grosland, what are you up to?
Emmett Grosland: Man, that is a dreaded question. Um, No, I am actually... you caught me at a good time cause I filmed yesterday.
Lili Torre: Oh, my gosh. Congratulations. What did you film?
Emmett Grosland: I have a very small part [00:01:00] on NBC's new Amsterdam.
Lili Torre: Amazing.
Emmett Grosland: yeah, I it's my third season with them. I am nurse Edward Brunstetter
Lili Torre: Oh, what a name!
Emmett Grosland: Brunstetter, I just like to Germanize it. Make it more fun. So I was filming yesterday, which is, I feel incredibly fortunate to be doing that right now. And the set is as safe as you could possibly make it. So if it's possible to be safe, it is
Lili Torre: Yeah. I was going to say is are the safety protocols and all of that... like, how is that going?
Emmett Grosland: There it's a lot of testing. So it's a PCR test, which is the like longer term, more accurate one. And you have to get that. I think it's 48 hours... like I had my PCR test on Tuesday, I believe. And then got the results Wednesday and then filmed Thursday. And then the day you're filming, when you walk in, they do a rapid test before you go to your dressing room
And you kind of sit in your dressing room and get the results while you're sitting in your dressing room to that one. So everybody is very tested.
[00:02:00] Lili Torre: Yeah, that's crazy. I mean, what a world, what a world we're in and especially, I'm sure for you having been with the show for a few seasons now, you have the experience of what that exact same, you know, set, group of people, all of that was like pre COVID. And now during COVID.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. I mean, it was a big family affair for lunches, you know, it was it was a... catering would come in and it was a big potluck feel. It was a buffet
And no longer, obviously that is not happening anymore. Now it's you put your order in and it's brought to your dressing room...
Lili Torre: wow.
Emmett Grosland: Which is nice but...
Lili Torre: Yeah. That community feel is kind of gone, I'm sure.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of downtime in filming anyway, where we're all sitting in our cast chairs and can chat and all that. But the chairs are now six feet apart though.
Lili Torre: well of course I would hope so.
Emmett Grosland: It's a medical show, so we're all wearing masks anyway the whole time.
Lili Torre: That's true. I didn't even think about that.
Emmett Grosland: So it actually fits. I haven't taken my mask off yet during filming this season, [00:03:00] so...
Lili Torre: Wow. That's wild.
Emmett Grosland: I'm also slightly safer than if I was filming something else. Some other subject matter.
Lili Torre: Yeah. It's funny. I've been thinking a lot about what type of art, you know, TV shows, film, theater, or whatever that are going to come out of COVID and just sort of like both just logistically, but also our psychological response. But logistically now I'm like, I wonder if there'll be even more doctor shows because everybody can wear masks and it'll make sense.
Emmett Grosland: True. True. Yeah. And it's not that it's not that everybody does the whole time. Cause obviously there's times when we're not in a surgery room or whatever, but I, my, my role, I tend to always be in some sort of dire traumatic situation. So...
Lili Torre: Of course, that's amazing. Well, thanks for sharing that, that was really interesting to hear about what the filming process has been like during COVID. And I know that on top of being a film and television actor, you also do [00:04:00] theater. And on top of theater, you also do art, both as a fine artist and a graphic designer, which is incredible.
I would love to hear more about how each of these avenues of your career path started.
Emmett Grosland: It's funny cause I wouldn't... I was thinking about talking to you. I was like, Oh my gosh, I have so many different like career paths I've gone down and like things I've explored. And then I sort of realized, nah, not really. I mean, it kind of all boils down to I'm an actor and an artist.
And art has taken many different forms for me over the, over the years. Partially because of interests and partially, because of like, just deciding where I could actually make a living and not.
So I started out... in high school, I was much more of a visual artist, and I danced and I sang and I did theater in the local community theater for fun, but I was never the best one at those things, but I was often the best one at the visual art.
So when I went to college, I actually made the decision to give up performing . I [00:05:00] was not going to pursue that at all. I was pursuing visual art completely. And I was pretty sure I was going to be pursuing some sort of like graphic design route.
Um, Just because that seemed the most like from what the world was telling me, that was the viable career path version of being an artist. And so I went to Washington University in St. Louis for graphic design. Within, I was probably within like two weeks of being there. I saw a notice for the musical auditions. And I was like, you know what, I'll just go. And I got in, and that was one of the few freshmen in it and I kind of didn't stop from there with going back into doing theater,
Lili Torre: What was the show?
Emmett Grosland: Oh, it was How to Succeed in Business Without Really Trying...not my favorite show, but it was fun.
And so I actually ended up getting a dual major cause it was- at Wash U it's, two separate schools. There's the art school. And then there's the liberal arts college. And so my, I crossed over, so I did my graphic [00:06:00] design degree, but I also did a dance degree.
And I did dance...I'm actually not a hundred percent sure why I did dance instead of theater. But I spent most of my time doing theater. And I had a wonderful advisor who did some finagling and allowed a lot of my theater credits to count as art electives. So that sort of started me in this, like figuring out how I could have this dual path happening.
Yeah. And over the years that's taken different forms. It's been graphic design. I do fine art. I sell paintings every once in a while, but don't focus on that as much as I'd like to. And now more recently in the last, like three or four years, I've been doing scenic art and properties design.
Lili Torre: That's amazing. I mean, even just the fact that you double majored in those things, I was actually thinking about this not too long ago, that. I think most universities are this way, but I really can only speak from my experience that [00:07:00] specifically being a musical theater major, it was essentially impossible to be a double major because the musical theater degree had the most credit requirements of any degree program in the university. And I mean, some people could like sort of make a minor work, but usually it had to be something like a dance minor where you were kind of double-dipping your credits.
But I feel like that in and of itself, while I understand it, especially for musical theater, because in some ways it's kind of like three degrees in one you're trying to like cram in. I feel like that is also contributing to this idea that like, if you're going to do this, if you're going to be a musical theater artist or a theater artist, this is all you're going to do. And that there's no space in your life for anything else.
And when I think about that, I'm like, no wonder all of these amazing artists come out of these programs thinking that's all they're capable of and all they're allowed to do, because I mean, that's what they're literally conditioned to think in college is [00:08:00] like, there's no space for anything else.
And so I love that you were able to find space and get that double major, fulfill, you know, the duality of your artistry. And I mean, it seems to have worked out for you.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, it's interesting. Cause I, I feel like particularly the art school , they definitely were of the mindset that like the art school would take up all of your time. There was no way you were going to do a double major. Like the art school was kind of like what you're describing with musical theater, where it was so many credits and it was so much time, all the classes were very long classes, like four hour classes.
So if I hadn't had that advisor who was a former dancer, I probably would have had a harder time, but she really believed in like the crossover of what I was doing. And she believed in like that my, you know, dance history class was just as valid [00:09:00] as my art history class. And so she would count that as my art history.
So it was really like her advocating for it that really helped. Cause I don't think I could have finished it in four years if I hadn't. Because I do think that that was the mindset there too. That was like, you need to focus in on one thing.
And I've been told that my whole life, like pick one and go with it, jack of all trades master of none . I've been told I'm Jack of all trades so much. It's hard to not let that seep in. But I feel as if I really very recently, I'm still figuring it out , have realized that that's kind of bullshit and that all of the, the various paths I'm on, they all inform each other and they all make me better at the other things.
Lili Torre: Yes, that's what I was just going to say is that, you know, that expression, Jack of all trades master of none, sort of implies that the trades don't inform each other, that if you're, you know... that you can be pretty good at a lot of [00:10:00] things and that being pretty good at a lot of things, doesn't culminate into anything. That that in and of itself doesn't create something that is masterful.
And, you know, I would also say obviously that you and all of TDQ's guests and all of the artists I know are more than pretty good at a lot of things- that are very good at a lot of things, but that it's, you don't have to just pick one thing and stick with it because everything that you do can inform everything that you do, so that you can achieve the level of mastery that you desire.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. And I think I also like this idea, idea of mastery or like being good at... I don't know. I think I'm starting to rethink this idea that I need to be like, there's a sort of like a level that I need to reach where there's like a finish line or something. As opposed to just following things that I'm interested in, excite me, that I'm passionate about.
[00:11:00] And devoting myself to the craft of those things without really feeling like there's some sort of benchmark goal in mind , allows me to bring in other, all these influences and really more worry about creating a body of work that I'm proud of or being the person I want to be even . As opposed to being like... I don't know, that I need to master some specific avenue within what I do.
I mean, it's all binary thinking, which as a, as like a non binary person, I think that, that has also shifted my mindset quite a bit because I've had to tear down the constructs of that whole concept of like, you're either this or you're that And I've just found such beauty in the concept of like, I don't know, just getting rid of that notion.
And just being without worrying about like being the most masculine or the most feminine or the most whatever, or the best singer or the hit with the highest note. [00:12:00] And like releasing that I, I feel has made me a better human and a better artist in all of my avenues.
Lili Torre: Yeah, I can imagine. It's very freeing and it's so funny, you're bringing up so many things that have been on my mind recently, including this idea of sort of being the best or being really good at what you do. And I think it, I think it involves what you're saying about binary thinking, because when I think about that about like, I gotta be the best I have to be at the top of my field or to be at the top of my game.
I often think about who decided what was good? Like whose definition of the best of, the most talented or whatever it is are we trying to achieve and fulfill? Because you know, it really should only be our own, but we have these outer expectations and these societal standards.
I mean, even the example you used, [00:13:00] who can sing the highest note, you know, for a woman it's like that's being the epitome of, of feminine is this high floaty soprano voice. So having the highest voice is like this achievement as being so feminine. And it's like, well, why? Like, who decided that that's what that means. That's so dumb.
And so I think there's really something to be said about setting your own, gauge your own marker, your own measuring stick of what it means for you to be the best. And it sounds like for you personally, it's about being inspired by the work that you're doing and being interested in the things that you're doing and allowing the things that you do to bolster the other things that you do.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, it's super important to me that what I am doing creates space and like a pathway for other trans artists , and questions things for cis artists as well. Like I think opening up the concept of gender is beneficial to everyone, not just [00:14:00] trans or GNC people.
So it's important to me that like in every aspect of what I do, I am allowing space for that to happen, for that change to happen. And I think that has become more important to me than like, yeah, like the highest note or the lowest note or whatever.
I have an interesting story about that. So for a long time I was taking, doing voice lessons to try to lower my voice and I have lowered it quite a bit. It was quite much, much higher than this. And my singing voice, especially I was a Mezzo soprano. And working hard to like, be able to sing typically male musical theater, repertoire. I was having to stretch my voice lower and lower.
But the other thing I discovered was that if I'm singing a high tenor a song, I can hit all the high notes. They're super easy for me. They're in the middle of my range, as opposed to being the top of my range as they would be for most cis male tenors. And so this weird thing happens where, because they're easy for me because they're in the middle of my voice, they don't [00:15:00] sound as exciting or difficult.
Lili Torre: Yeah, that's true.
Emmett Grosland: And so I was actually training myself to manufacture my high tenor notes that was in quotes sounding difficult
Lili Torre: Yeah.
Emmett Grosland: And putting, like adding strain to those notes so that they sounded exciting and hard, which is such a weird concept.
Lili Torre: That is so strange.
Emmett Grosland: Because usually it's like, you're trying to attain this ease on those notes. But I was finding because they were so comfortable, that excitement was gone
Anyway, I think that's, I just, I think about that sometimes. And I, I still work on that cause it is useful for certain roles. But it's also like, it just turned on its head. This whole notion of like the goal is to sing the highest note, because I can already sing higher than just about any cis male, but it actually doesn't benefit me.
Lili Torre: Yeah. That's so funny. That's like the reverse of what I was saying before. Yeah. It is truly wild. And it's another great [00:16:00] reminder about again what we're saying is like using your own measuring stick of what it means to be good at your art and good at what you do.
And even like how you tell a story. So it's like for you, you know, you were adding in some... that more effortful sound to achieve that kind of, you know the stakes in the moment, but there's also ways that you can tweak the physicality, how you're telling the story and the acting of it and like that makes that performance so uniquely Emmett and not just another rendition of "On the Street Where You Live."
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, and it, it also speaks so much to like what you were saying with who decides? And not to get too political here, but it all comes down to capitalism, really. It's what's sellable in the current market. And so I think a lot of times who decides is the white CIS male het culture.
And a [00:17:00] lot of times I have found very recently, especially that I don't fit... there's nothing I can do to fit into a lot of that. So it kind of forced me... it just allowed me to say, you know, fuck you about like a lot of those rules, because I can't possibly ever really fit into those expectations.
And so it's freeing in a way that I can't, because it, it forced me, who is someone who normally would want to like, do everything I can to fit. It forced me to have to just say, you know what? Fuck it. I have to invent my own thing here.
Lili Torre: Yeah. And I mean, it kind of seems like that's been a theme for you for a while. Like you created your own sort of mishmash degree in college, and even the way that you, you know, finagled the credits to apply so that you could make that work. Like you really kind of have gone about a lot of things in your own way.
And I'm [00:18:00] curious, when you left college and you went out into the real world, as they say, how did you approach your career? Were you like, okay, I'm going to start with this one thing and focus on that? Or were you kind of trying to pursue all the things simultaneously? Like how did that work for you?
Emmett Grosland: I was lucky enough to ... I overlapped my professional career with college because I worked at Stages St. Louis while I was still in college and I worked there a couple summers. And so that kind of got me started immediately and put my mindset immediately into doing theater and professional theater straight out of school.
So I went straight into that. I also though was already designing things for like the performing arts department at my university , graphic design wise. And so that also put me into doing graphic design straight out of school as well, mostly for theater companies and other performing arts organizations.
So I went straight [00:19:00] from, I did summer stock and then I went to a, I did children's theater in California for a few years. And while I was doing those theater gigs and those were all non-union theater gigs, I was also doing freelance graphic design.
And then, because it was summer stock and because it was children's theater, it was the kind of setup where it was a company of actors who also did, you know, the scenic painting and the choreography.
And yeah, so that also helped too, because that got me, I did, for three years, I did scenic art for the children's theater I was also acting for under like, you know, someone who was a professional scenic artist. So I gained those skills, doing that.
And I had designed a couple sets in college as well, so I just kind of always... I don't know if I tried to put myself or it just happened, but I was ended up in situations where I was able to pursue both. And whenever those opportunities came up, I took them.
So then I did, I did children's theaterm then I did I worked for the LA Opera [00:20:00] for three years as a dancer for them. And while I was doing that, I was still doing graphic design as my, like... back then, I thought of it as a side gig. And I eventually did ... on my way to New York, I booked the national tour of Grinch
Lili Torre: Oh, wow.
Emmett Grosland: I was driving to New York with no job prospects at all. And I got the call about halfway across the country. And I had auditioned in LA because they were going to be rehearsing in LA originally. And they were like, but there's one problem. We're actually gonna rehearse in New York. And I was like, that's really convenient. Cause I'm driving to New York right now.
So, I did that. It was a non-union tour of that. And then immediately after that was closed, I joined the union and did the regional theater route and still did graphic design during all of that.
And then like a few years ago I had done a couple off Broadway things and some small TV things, and I sort of decided I wanted to stick around New York a little bit more [00:21:00] and not do as much regional.
Unless it was like something, you know...you know how it is.
Lili Torre: Sure of course
Emmett Grosland: But so about three years ago I started doing scenic art more and that sort of branched into doing props just because that just seems to happen. So I was staying in New York at this point, trying to stick around. And so when you do scenic art it's harder to leave, cause it's more, it's more of a... like graphic design I can do from anywhere. It's all remote. Obviously scenic art I have to physically be there. So it was easier to do now that I was sticking around.
So now I do- I'm the scenic charge at New School. And scenic charge and properties master. I have some other title there too. Like I think I'm the, artistic design associate? Something like that at Mile Square theater out in Jersey. And I do props and some production management at Columbia University.
And those are a little bit more of like a stable, they're still contract positions, but it's a stable, more of a stable staying in New York type thing. And I still do graphic design, but I've really [00:22:00] narrowed that down to the things that I enjoy doing.
So now I mostly do logos and like illustration type stuff, logos and branding and illustration.
Lili Torre: That's amazing. There's so much, I love about what you just said. So I'm just going to try to take it one at a time.
I mean, going back to when you were talking about summer stock, there's this sort of like perception of that type of summer stock, that it's like a rite of passage. It's like this, this thing that you have to do when you're non-union and you have to do this like grueling experience where you're also working in the costume shop or building sets or whatever.
And I love that for you, that wasn't the experience because it is something that you actively enjoy doing and not just enjoy, it's part of your craft as well. Yeah. So this thing that has this, like reputation of being this like [00:23:00] grueling horrible thing, could actually be joyful and fulfilling to you because you had developed those parts of yourself and your artistry and your craft.
And I think that that's just, it's just such a cool thing to hear. It's one of the few times I've ever heard someone speak about summer stock in that way. And I think that that's, I think back to like, in college when we had to do practicum and help in, in some other form of theater design and, you know, actors would complain about it all the time.
It was like their least favorite part of the program. And the thing is that there was so much value there. And there was so much that we were getting out of it that if you could just, like you said, like, find the things that interest you and that you enjoy. Like, for me, it was actually a props as well.
I did props for three of my six semesters because I enjoyed doing it so much and I really liked our props Mistress. But because of that, like, I [00:24:00] didn't have that same hatred for it that everyone else had.
And yeah. One semester, you know, for a show, they needed some costumes that were knitted and I love to knit. So I was like, Hey, what if I do costume shop, but I only knit those costumes? And they were like, perfect, sounds good. Like that'll count. And so, you know, like you said, kind of tailor making your experiences to what you're good at and what you like and what you want to improve in. I think that's so cool.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, and I it's interesting props. I think props is the one that I didn't seek out props, that one just sort of happened to me, but it is the one that I feel has the most crossover to being an actor, because you really have to think like the character.
Like what pen would this character have? Like, you know, you have to, and like, you have to have other knowledge that the actor may not need to have, like what kind of pen in that era or whatever.
But the idea that like, Oh my gosh, this character would never have a pink sparkly pen or like the pink sparkly pen with the feather fluff on top is exactly the pen that this [00:25:00] character would have. And so there's a lot of crossover and things like that. For me as an actor and as a prop designer where I really can think about like who this person is, because I can put myself in the place of like, if I was playing this character, how would I develop them as a human? And then what objects speak about that?
So it's, that's a natural extension and it's similar. I mean, like, as a scenic artist a lot of times I'm being told what to paint what color to paint things or what to do with things. But there's also something... I don't know.
I mean, there's something magical about being in a theater in any capacity. I do feel like there's something about being an actor for me, that I've always connected to the physical world of the set and found that really informing of my character. Like I'm always that actor that like, if there's something I can climb on, I'm going to climb on it.
And I think, I think being ... doing scenic art , for me has been a natural crossover because of that, because I, [00:26:00] it has made me as an actor even more see, like, see the little decisions that went into what wallpaper's on this wall or what kind of end table is in this room. And really realizing that those things were thought out. And like, if I'm the character who designed this room, if this is my home, why did I pick that wallpaper?
So there's actually a lot of crossover between acting and scenic art for me, as well as the props.
Lili Torre: I love that because it's such a good reminder, like this seems like such a basic thing, but we think of theater as being so collaborative, but I do feel like oftentimes we miss opportunities for collaboration or we don't recognize that someone else is trying to play with us, if that makes sense?
So like, someone choosing this wallpaper, like you said, you know that... they were so intentional about that choice for you, the character, for this story that you're telling. [00:27:00] And so, you know, that person is saying like, here's what I think, like, play with me, play with it! Like use it, like enjoy it!
Rather than just being like uh, whatever, like there's wallpaper on the wall. Like, I don't know, but, and completely ignoring it and being like, so in your head about, I have to create this character. What are my lines? What am I doing? Where's my blocking? Rather than just looking around and seeing all of the collaboration around you. I love that.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. Like even, even something as that is normally I think sort of invisible, like painting a wood floor, like painting a full wood floor, for instance. There's there's a reason why it's as damaged as it is, or as new and shiny as it is. There's like, I'll leave, I'll do things like put scratch marks where a chair is that I think that somebody might have moved a million times.
Lili Torre: Yes. Oh, that's so cool.
Emmett Grosland: And those little things are things that previous to really doing scenic painting. I don't know that I would've thought about as an actor. But like now if I see somebody has done something like that, I'll move [00:28:00] that chair, you know, like ...
Yeah. I just think that there's a whole story being told by lots of people. And like, for me, it's sort of become that I want to tell stories and I, what form that takes is lesser than telling the story in general and what stories I'm telling.
Lili Torre: Yes, well speaking of, you know, telling stories and what form that takes, how did you start working in film and television?
Emmett Grosland: So I, my agents when I got them I was doing a play off Broadway. And I had only really done theater previous to working with them. It's Boals, Winnett, & Associates. And they're wonderful. And I remember, maybe my first meeting or it was when I was sending my contract with them.
Judy Boals she, she said something like "We'll work on getting you your, that feature film" or something. And I laughed and she's like, she looked me straight in the eyes and she was like, "Don't laugh. We're going to." I was like, okay. And cause it was something that I, [00:29:00] like many people , I erroneously thought of it as unattainable. And as like, I don't know, like something, some, something other people got,
And my agents really did a good job shifting that for me. And so I really now, I mean, I still love theater and still pursue it. But I love doing TV. Like I did not think I would like that world or the like the non-linear aspect of it. I love it. I think it's, I love this, the feeling that it's like kind of feels nine to five. It's not, but it kind of feels like, you know, you go in, in the morning, you work all day with the same people and you go home.
It's it's also so much just in a financial way, so much more valued, which is completely unfortunate and awful. But it's also, it's made me really, for lack of a better word, angry about how undervalued acting in theatre is.
Lili Torre: Right. Yeah.
Emmett Grosland: And so for me, it's, that's a big part of it is focusing on it [00:30:00] because I feel so much more valued. And I love doing new work in theater. And so like sometimes the value comes out of that, of course. But there's also this feeling of being taken advantage of in a lot of situations in theater. And I'm not sure how we shift that, but it needs to get shifted.
Lili Torre: Yes, definitely. I mean, it is funny, I feel like when friends who are theater, artists have started doing film and television that tends to become, you know, much more of the focus because, you know, it's like, why am I fighting so hard to work somewhere where I don't feel valued simply just on a level of like, you don't pay me what I need to survive. And so I just don't feel valued.
And whereas in film and television, you know, one line will pay you more than an entire theater contract. And, it's kind of a cliche to be like, "Well, I'm not in it for the money," but like, [00:31:00] okay, but you need to survive and you're allowed to want to have money and be stable and be okay and not scrape for every penny.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. It's not even a question of like making like gobs and gobs of money. It's a question of like, there are theater contracts. I've worked on that if you break it down, you're making like $7 an hour, sometimes even less. Or you're making zero depending on what you're working on. And it's just not livable. It's not. Especially in New York.
Lili Torre: Exactly. That's kind of the, the cherry on top for me is that theater artists get paid so little and then are also expected to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world on top of it, is just like an irony I can never get over.
Emmett Grosland: Yes.
Lili Torre: Well, I'm so glad that you started doing film and television and that it has been fulfilling in many ways and joyful for you and that it's been going so well. That's incredible to hear.
And I'm also [00:32:00] curious about, you know, you were talking about some of the positions that you hold at a variety of universities and you know, jobs that you hold with scenic design and props design. And I'm curious how you balance that with film and television. Cause like you said, it can be pretty long hours...
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. I mean, currently I have a very, very small role. So I currently work one to two days a month on New Amsterdam. And when I work those days, it's all day, and I've made sure that my jobs are aware of the fact that, and I tell them flat out that like my priority is going to be filming if I have a filming day.
And so they all are okay with that and know that and my positions with all of them are they're all contract by contract. I'm not like full time salaried position with any of them , purposefully. I'm hourly. Because that way I can control it a little bit more.
The other thing that's great about scenic art specifically, and props really, is a lot of it is [00:33:00] on my own time. So like it's different, the universities are different, Like I'm a little more tied to hours for scenic art, especially at like New School. But my props and scenic art position at Mile Square Theater, for instance, which is a regional equity house. I have keys to the building so I can go paint in the middle of the night if I want.
And so a lot of it's on my own schedule, which really, really helps. And of course, graphic design is very much my own schedule because I do it all from home.
Lili Torre: Right, which is so great. I mean, have you found during COVID that graphic design has been the thing that's helped to keep you afloat?
Emmett Grosland: It's interesting. Cause I, I had been distancing myself from doing graphic design. Partly because it's very isolating ironically. And I tend to be a hermit. So I got back into doing scenic art partially because I was finding that, that hermit thing wasn't working for me mentally for my mental health.
And so [00:34:00] I started doing scenic art as a way of just being in the presence of a theater more, and other humans and other artists. And that really was working for me. And I was enjoying it a lot. But now that I've been, I've been very seriously quarantining and I'm also kind of like, I'm an introvert, so I enjoy a lot of the isolation of this.
So yeah, I've been doing a little bit more, but the other thing I did was I set up a recording booth in a closet in my apartment, which is what I'm in right now. And so I've been doing some book narration.
Yeah. So I've been doing, I've been narrating for Simon and Schuster. A few different, I've done a few projects for them so far. And then I recorded for a little commercial thing that shall not be named, so I've been just doing more voiceover stuff, which is really interesting and fun.
Lili Torre: Yeah. I'm actually really glad that you're doing that [00:35:00] because I was sitting here thinking about how nice your voice is to listen to you. So I feel like you'd be great at that. That's awesome.
Emmett Grosland: You should go over to actually the one that, that one of the really cool projects that I'm going to plug right now...
It's called The World to Come. And it is a musical podcast and I don't even know how to describe it. It's like post-apocalyptic sci-fi maybe? I don't know what it is, but it's very good.
It's very funny. It's by Erik Ransom and it's very good. It's very funny. But anyway, so head over to wherever you get your podcasts, I think you can find it!
Lili Torre: Yes, I'll link in the show notes, for sure. That sounds awesome. I love that, that you have taken on yet another form of storytelling and artistry in this time through voiceover and book narration. I think that's really great. You know, as well as doing your graphic design work, of course.
And I think that's so smart. And self-aware that you know that your tendency is to be more introverted and to sort of [00:36:00] become a hermit. And so, I mean, that is one of the things about being a freelance artist is it can be very solitary not to say lonely.
Because you know, even like what you were saying with the work that you're doing in the various theaters and universities, it's all contract work. And so while I'm sure you're working with a lot of the same people over and over, you're the only one on your exact journey. You're the only one who works at that exact collection of places and is on New Amsterdam and is a graphic designer and does fine art and is a voiceover artist. Like you're the only person with that exact path. And it can feel kind of lonely, even when you're around a lot of other people.
And so I would love to know... I mean I know that you said you're naturally an introvert, so maybe that doesn't bother you as much, but [00:37:00] if there are times where it feels a little solitary, what is it that keeps you going down that path?
Emmett Grosland: First off, I enjoy the solitary aspect of it in a lot of ways.
I think for me I always have this feeling that at my back are young trans artists. And ahead of me are older trans artists. And so I feel like that lineage keeps me going in a lot of ways because I feel, in the best way possible an obligation to both the people who have opened doors in front of me, as well as the people behind me who need doors, more doors opened for them.
And so I think that for me, as much as I feel isolated, there is a sense of community within the trans community and specifically within the trans artist community. And even more specifically within the trans New York artist community. That like, even though I may [00:38:00] not be hanging out with that group of people on a daily basis , I do consider a lot of them to be my friends and even the people I don't really know. There is a sense that we are together in this. And so that makes me feel much less isolated.
Lili Torre: Yes. I love that. That's beautiful. I mean, it's true. Like again while no one has had your literal exact path, it's important to look around and see who else is on similar paths or is ahead of you forging the path. You know, sometimes I talk about like, having a parallel career path and doing that type of work can kind of feel like you're taking a machete through a forest and just kind of hacking and slashing and trying to find a way through, and sometimes it's fun and sometimes the work feels satisfying because you're, you're hacking a lot down and sometimes you're like, Oh my God, [00:39:00] I just want to put this down and catch my breath.
And so I think it's important to, you know, maybe those moments of catching your breath are really so that you can see, yes, I'm still having a hack and slash a lot of things, but I can see the stumps of where someone else has already cut some things down for me. And those are things I don't have to cut down for myself. And I think that that is a great reminder that you're not alone on this journey.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, exactly. And then the idea that like it's worth the effort of forging a path just because I know from doing outreach with trans youth, that like, it's worth it. Cause I know that like a lot of the bullshit that I've had to deal with both as a non-binary person and also as like non-binary worker, or if you want, if you want to call it that , it's going to make those things, not even... some of the stuff I've dealt with, isn't even going to be thought [00:40:00] of by people behind me.
Like they're not even going to have to think about it. It's not going to be on their radar. And that idea that like the brain space that is taken up by some things that are not fun. Won't be taken up hopefully, because of something I was able to struggle through and hopefully like change in, you know, at a specific theater or on a specific set.
Lili Torre: That's amazing. That's such a great answer and it's such a great reminder. I think for all of us, whatever, whatever journey we're on, whoever came ahead of us, whoever we're forging a path for behind us, that checking in with those things is really what's going to keep you going.
And, you know, I think that you just have such a incredible and unique mindset about your work and what it means to be good at something, what it means to be fulfilled by your work, that really embodies so much of what I'm trying to communicate on this podcast. That [00:41:00] again, kind of, I really loved what we talked about with the idea of Jack of all trades, master of none that like being a Jack of all trades makes you your own unique master. And I think that that is just really powerful.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah, and it can be overwhelming. Like I do get overwhelmed because I do have, as when you list everything I do, like, I do get overwhelmed about it. You know, it's my, my day isn't clear, like my day isn't like at nine o'clock I go to do this thing. I do that all day and then I go home. And so there is the side effect of doing what I do that it is... I am sometimes, always on the clock. Or it feels like that.
And I am just now really honing in on what it means to really choose which paths I'm following. And part of that is privilege. Part of that is that I am getting to a place where I can choose. I think a lot of me doing a million different things originally was spurred both by [00:42:00] interest, but also by necessity of like, I needed to piece together enough income to live in New York.
And I am now some of those things are blossoming more than others. And I'm able now, a little bit, to hone in on like with graphic design. I don't take on projects anymore of like, can you lay out this, you know, flyer? Cause I don't enjoy that. Some people do, I don't. And so I have, I am in a place, luckily, I mean, COVID has thrown all of this for the loop, but where I can say, I love doing logos. I love doing branding. I love doing illustration. So for now that's all I'm going to do in the graphic design world.
Lili Torre: Yeah. Setting those boundaries is so freeing.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. And being able to, to, you know, narrow and narrow and narrow until, it is more clear. I'll never be on one single path. That's never going to happen, but like I could, I could have a series regular on a network [00:43:00] show and be making more than enough money and I would still be doing art.
Like I know that not that's not the question. So I, when I realized that was when I stopped calling it like a side gig or a backup or something, because I realized it wasn't. Cause it's something I will always do in some form. So I now call it my parallel careers.
Lili Torre: Yay. I love that. And that, yeah, that's exactly like when, when I'm speaking with people and defining what a parallel career is exactly, that's part of it. Part of that definition is that you wouldn't quit it even when the dream job came along. And that very much sounds like that's what graphic design is for you.
But it also doesn't mean that you have to do every element of it. Like you were saying, like putting up those boundaries is what keeps it enjoyable and special and art for you.
Emmett Grosland: Yeah. And I think, I think realizing that the graphic design, the scenic art is all [00:44:00] actually one thing, it's all art to me was helpful too, because like just chunking it down into one vein, just mentally has helped a lot. And like the voiceover feels like that's acting, so I it's really just the two. And they just take different forms.
Lili Torre: Yeah. Well, Emmett, thank you so much for, for chatting with me today and sharing your story. I think you have such a amazing perspective and I just loved so much of what we talked about today, and I'm really, really glad that we got to sit down and have this chat.
Emmett Grosland: Me too. It was fun. I'll still dread the question. Sorry.
Lili Torre: Yeah it's pretty awful, I get it.
Talk about being an intentional, purpose driven artist. Emmett brought up a lot things that come with being a multihyphenate artist and/or having a parallel career.
That jack of all trades feeling or fear that comes up is very real, and one of my big hopes for our generation is that we can dismantle that myth [00:45:00] and drive home the fact that being good at many things, makes you better at each of those things.
I'm linking Emmett's website in the show notes, as well as a link to The World to Come musical podcast so we can all go enjoy it! And if you're a New Amsterdam fan, make sure to keep an eye out for Emmett!
I hope that you enjoyed today's episode and as always, I'm so grateful to you for listening. I'm Lili Torre and this has been The Dreaded Question. .